S2E7: Sass Rogando Sasot

Episode Transcript:

[Webster:] Killed it

(Laughter)

[Evy:] For once!

(Laughter)

[Webster:] Say something.

[Unknown voice:] What did you have for breakfast?

[Webster:] What did I have for breakfast… I skipped breakfast today.

[Evy:] Ooh..

[Webster:] And I had uh… lunch I had… it was a really weird sandwich. It was like tuna… tuna, beef. I had some fried mushrooms on there...

---Transition---


[Evy:] Hello and welcome to Word Up Podcast. I’m Evy.

[Webster:] And I’m Webster.

Evy: And today, we are here with Sass. Hello!

[Sass:] Hello, everyone. This is Sass.

[Evy:] So happy to have you here. Thank you for coming all the way from Maastricht

[Sass:] Always good to come here in Amsterdam. It’s like my second home.

(Laughter)

[Evy:] Aww, that’s nice to hear. And can you tell us a little bit about yourself?

[Sass:] Well, it’s hard to box me right now, cause I’ve been doing a lot of things. But if there are three things that come to mind, I would say artist, advocate and teacher!

[Evy:] Ok..

[Sass:] So, the first, that’s what I do when I’m not the last one, teacher, is what I do when I’m not batman. So, the other two, just like what I do on the side..

[Evy:] Right

[Webster:] What type of art do you do exactly?

Sass: Uhm, I actually consider myself a writer

[Webster:] Right..

[Sass:] And then, for about a year now, I’ve been exploring DJ’ing, so I’ve been playing squats in Maastricht

[Evy:] Oh, wow! What kind of music do you play?

[Sass:] Usually, it’s techno. So, yeah...

[Evy:] Wow

[Webster:] I would not have imagined you as a techno kind of person
(Laughter)

[Sass:] Why?

(Laughter)

[Webster:] Just from meeting you… I don’t know, just like when I think of techno, I just think ‘super hardcore ravers’, maybe you are that but…

[Sass:] But what do I look like?

(Laughter)

[Webster:] You look like a very nice polite lady

(Laughter)

[Sass:] OMG! Do I exude that aura?

(Laughter)


[Webster:] I don’t know, tell us. Maybe not, maybe I’m wrong. Maybe I need to be corrected.

[Sass:] No, I’m not usually that [laughter] If I exude that, I’m not really sure how I come off to… appear to others.

[Evy:] Right.

[Sass:] Yeah…

[Evy:] And, well, I know you as an artist…

[Sass:] Yes

(Laughter)


[Evy:] Can you tell us a little bit more about your art and what inspires you?

[Sass:] Uhm, well, I’ve been writing poetry for quite a while now, and a lot of things inspire me. But usually, they are mostly about, you know, in the themes of falling in love; love; a bit of eroticism and a bit of spirituality. And aside, I’ve been reading a lot of mystical poets so I’m really inspired by the way they write because it’s always so erotic.

[Evy:] Uhm uhm..

(Laughter)


[Sass:] So, it just burns your soul while you read it. Yeah, and, of course, my experience as well. My everyday experience. I usually write when I have this overwhelming emotion that I’m feeling. And usually, writing is one of my outlets, and then last year I discovered, like, DJ’ing became an outlet for releasing that bubbling emotion inside of me, so yeah. Because sometimes your emotions can be so unbearable, so you need an outlet in order to make it more bearable.

[Evy:] Right, and do you find that since you DJ, do you write less or?

[Sass:] No, actually, it kind of, you know, cross-pollinated each other.

[Evy:] Oh, nice

[Sass:] Right, like I usually construct my DJ set following a narrative. So I really prepare a lot, like, I do my transition just like how I do a poem. So I… and then, the music helps me write better, because, you know, it improves my sense of melody, sense of rhythm. So it’s… they are cross-pollinating each other.

[Evy:] Right. Wow, it’s kind of like a storytelling throughout…

[Sass:] Yeah, I think… yeah, if I would really summarize what I’ve been doing, it’s really about storytelling. Because even in my advocacy, that’s really my medium, storytelling. Even when I teach, it’s really about storytelling. And even when I write a poem, so a lot of my poem really are like stories being told. It’s… the narrative structure is really present in whatever I’m doing. So, yeah, so maybe I’m just a storyteller.

[Evy:] And is it fictional stories or experience-based or…?

[Sass:] Well, most of my… it’s always experience-based, so of course they are fictionalized right?

[Evy:] Yeah..

[Sass:] You let your imagination run wild, that you imagine how things could be, right?

[Evy:] Right..

[Sass:] If things took a different turn, and then you imagine how it would be.

[Evy:] Right..

[Webster:] And where are you sourcing your inspiration from? I know you said you usually have something that you wanna get off your chest. Does it have to be something negative or do you get positive stories out that you wanna share as well?

[Sass:] I usually write more when I feel an overwhelming positive emotion

[Webster:] Ok, right…

[Sass:] Or, when I process already the negative emotion that I’m feeling, and then when I’m already at peace with it, and then that’s the time that I start to write. Because I have been through a lot in my life, so I have a lot of materials to choose from.

(Laughter)

I think I’m just like a kind of person who likes to experience life a lot, so I’ve been through a lot as well. And that kind of enriched whatever I’m actually doing, not just when I’m writing or when I’m DJ’ing, even when I’m teaching. Like, you need to make these things more human for them, for the students to learn better. And usually, I use my own experience in order to convey a better message for them.


Evy: Wow..

[Webster:] For our audience who doesn’t know you, can you tell us a bit about yourself? I feel like we’ve jumped (laughter/inaudible)... We don’t know your story yet. How did you get to be here in the Netherlands? And how did you get to teaching, and doing art and sharing your stories?

[Sass:] Well, I’m Sass and I’m originally from Manila, Philippines. I was born in Manila but I always say that if I was born in Manila, I got born free in Amsterdam. I’m actually a Trans woman, I’m a transgender filipina woman, and it was actually here in Amsterdam that I had my operation done, so it was just like being reborn in Amsterdam. That’s why I always feel so alive whenever I come here in Amsterdam because it’s just like, you know, you felt like… ok, this is actually where I started to live fully.

And, I’ve been an activist, doing advocacy work on transgender rights in the Philippines since I was 19, and I’m already 37. Actually, not yet 19… when I was 18… so it was..

(Laughter)


[Webster:] Wow…

[Sass:] One year earlier! I started doing that after I committed suicide. So I attempted suicide when… after graduating highschool, it was also the time that I came out to my mother, and I was like… and then, she didn’t understand it, right? It was a mixture of fear, ignorance, etc. all bottled up into this human being. And then, she related me through that so she rejected me. And she kind of gave me an ultimatum that, either you stay in my house, I’m gonna pay for your education, but you have to follow what I would like you to be, and that is that you have to live like a man, and then you just do whatever you wanna do, if you’re already rich or whatever. Or, do whatever you wanna do but you have to leave the house.

And I just graduated from highschool during that time so I was just, like, kind of confused, etc. And, I just broke up with my ex boyfriend, my first boyfriend, and then everything was just like, “OMG, my world is falling down!”

And then, I attempted suicide by hanging, it was December 2000. And then, I was, like, so prepared to die. I prepared the song list that I would like to be played in my funeral, what I wanted to hear at my funeral, it was just like really, you know, I’m prepared! I called a friend of mine and I just told him that I’m gone. Like, this is the last time that we’re gonna talk to each other etc. And then, while I was hanging and… I was already feeling like my body going numb, my ears were, like, popping…

[Evy:] Right..

[Sass:] Like, I could already hear the sound of a flat lifeline, and then it was just like something inside of me, just like struggled to live. And then, of course, I succeeded. And then, when I came down from being hanged, I was… it was just like some sort of realization. Like, I’m sure there are other people like me going through the same thing so why don’t I just use my life for this. Because before that, I was, like, already interested in trans issues, so in high school, I studied in an exclusive school for boys. So, catholic school for boys. And then, when I had a boyfriend, that became a scandal because it was just so open. Just like, I don’t know, I’m not ashamed. I think, them being Buddhist helped a lot, so they were just like “OK, we are not under your doctrine, we’re buddhist.”

[Sass:] So, yeah, and that’s the time that I started dealing with this. And he was also supportive, he bought me a book about it that we saw from a music store in the Philippines. And then, so, I had already some sort of knowledge about how to go about it. And then, from that moment, when I had the realization after I attempted suicide, I just like… you know, went full frontal. Like, I left all my family and then lived for some time in public park. I met a lot of people along the way, and it’s just so amazingly that I kept meeting people that just lead me to the one step to the next step. So, yeah, and then I’ve co-founded the pioneer transgender rights advocacy group in the Philippines, it’s called Society of Transsexual Women of the Philippines.

There was no organization before. And then, so I co-founded it, and then, yeah and just… one thing just led to another, and then my studies was put… was, of course, put in the backburner. And, I… but I always wanted to live in the Netherlands, I always wanted to live in Europe. If there was anywhere I would like to live, it ‘s in Europe and the Netherlands.

And then I met my ex in Copenhagen during a conference, right? He was like visiting Copenhagen, and he’s Dutch. And then, it’s just like ok, maybe this is a sign. And then, I started living here in 2011. So, I went back to school, and then after graduating, I applied for a job in Maastricht University and became a teacher.

[Evy:] Ok, that’s quite a journey…

[Webster:] That is an amazing story…

[Sass:] Yeah, but there are a lot of things that happened in between, but... that’s it in a nutshell.

(Laughter)


[Webster:] That is an incredible story

[Sass:] Yeah, I’m quite amazed by what I’ve been through, right? Sometimes you surprise yourself that ‘OMG, I’ve been through so much shit, and you’re still like standing’.
[laughter]

[Evy:] Uhm uhm..

[Webster:] And it’s amazing to hear you speak about it so clearly and honestly. Was it always that easy to speak about that?

[Sass:] I think one thing that… it’s… I never find it hard to speak about my experience. I think what I find it hard to speak about was some of the traumatic… only one… I think only one traumatic experience that I’ve gone through that it took me a while to actually vocalize it. And it was actually my first boyfriend who actually learned about that and he… I was just like breaking… I think his love actually made it possible for me to break open and to start accepting what happened and to heal from it. So, that’s why I always believe in the power of love…

(Laughter)


[Sass:] So yeah, I’m… I think it’s… because I consider myself as a very reflective person so that’s why I don’t really… I don’t find it hard to talk about these things.

[Evy:] Yeah, it sounds like your story to me… it’s kind of like the phoenix being reborn, you have to be broken to...

[Sass:] That’s my tattoo!

(Laughter)

[Evy:] Wow!

[Sass:] I had it tattooed in my arm!

[Evy:] I didn’t know that!

(Laughter)


[Sass:] Right, so... Yeah…

[Evy:] Wow, like I said it’s like… is this also somewhere where your poetry comes in that? Like through that? It’s also the story of… because I remember when you sent me the concept of one of the performances, it was about… Nirvana and (inaudible). Can you tell us a little bit more about that?

[Sass:] Yeah, it was originally my concept for WordUp…

[Evy:] Outspoken, yeah…

[Sass:] Outspoken Event in Volkshotel. It was actually about being born with two bodies..

[Evy:] Yeah

[Sass:] Because usually when you speak about the trans experience, the classical transsexual experience, it’s about being born in the wrong body, or being trapped in the wrong body. And that trope actually do not speak to me. And I feel that very dis-empowering, and I feel like to me, your body is yourself, right? If you say that, in your brain you’re this… your brain is part of your body…

[Evy:] Uhm uhm…

[Sass:] Right? And then as I learned more about, you know, the transsexual condition, and then one of the theories that our brain actually has its own body map, right? And it develops differently from own own body. And then, it just so happens that, you know, some people’s body map do not correspond to their physical or external body. And then, that actually inspired me to think ‘Ok, I was actually born with two bodies’, right?

[Evy:] Right…

[Sass:] And these two bodies felt disconnected with each other. So I’m not trapped, I just happen to be born with two bodies.
(Laughter)


[Evy:] Right…

[Sass:] Right? So, it was a very empowering notion for me. You know, not thinking of myself as wrong. You know, I don’t wanna think of my body as wrong, it’s just like what it is, right? And, yeah, that’s the entire idea behind the concept of the two bodies.

[Evy:] Wow..


[Webster:] Do you think recent social movements have made it easier for trans people to just be, and to come out and live as they are? Or is that something that’s… I don’t know, how do you feel about it?

[Sass:] Well, in the Philippines we have always, there was always this space of living openly. I think in… But, you are relegated into a certain, you know, layer of society. In the West, definitely, people coming out and speaking out made it possible for a lot of trans people to come out. But I think one thing that’s really missing is that, you know, experience, understanding trans people as everyday people, right? So whenever… And that’s what I also learned throughout the years when I was engaged in advocacy, that… I think it’s even, in some way a shortcoming of advocacy itself. Right?

Like, for example, the Netherlands. The Netherlands, it’s like a really advanced law. However, in everyday experience, you know, the people… their minds are still like, as if this development didn’t happen. So I was just like, so why is there a discrepancy? I think it’s because, you know, what’s happening on top was changed but, you know, how people imagine life has not changed. Right? So that’s why this kind of representation is necessary, because if you do not change, you know, how we imagine and see things then how can, you know, everyday life would follow through?

[Webster:] Yeah, cause you can change laws but you can’t make people think a certain way.

[Sass:] Exactly, you cannot legislate people to imagine life

[Webster:] Yeah…

[Sass:] Right? So you can sue them, etc., but if what they’re seeing in, let’s say, for… on television, in movies, it’s just this… Like, those are the primary medium of representation, then nothing, no change would happen.

[Evy:] And, when you’re going through your process, did you have someone to inspire you, or to help you? Did you have someone that you were looking up to? Or you had to go through that just with just trial and error....?

[Sass:] Well, I had… because… it’s already part of Filipino culture to be closely knit. We were kind of like heard culture.

So, back in my school, the older batch, they were already like telling me when I was just like 12, “Oh, before you… when you turn 13, you should take hormones already, so that you would erase the [inaudible], you wouldn’t be masculine, etc. So they kind of taught me, you know, which hormones to take. Because, in the Philippines, back at that time, you can buy it over the counter.

[Webster + Evy:] Wow.

[Sass:] Without prescription. So it was so easy to get it. So, the pitfall is that you don’t have medical supervision, right?

[Evy:] Wow..

[Sass:] Yeah, so I started like at 13. And then, yeah, it’s just… but I fully, like… socially, I started transition like really young. I never really lived my life, like, as a boy. Even though I was studying in an exclusive school for boys, I was like, walking just like a girl, in an exclusive school for boys. So, that’s why I never… I didn’t have that identity crisis that they always portray on television. Like one day, they woke up at home, ‘am I a boy or a girl?’, never happened to me. But the full medical, physical transition happened here in the Netherlands because it’s covered by the national healthcare system.

[Evy:] Right.

[Sass:] So…

[Webster:] That’s great!

[Sass:] Yeah, it is!

(Laughter)

[Evy:] Do you have advice for people who are in your situation, or for thinking or feeling lost, or cannot connect the body with the mind or feeling born in more bodies than one?

[Sass:] I think my first advice is not to hate yourself, right? Because if you hate yourself, that’s… I think that’s the beginning of every negative thing that would happen to you, right? Because at the end of the day, you will be with yourself, right? So as much as possible, appreciate yourself, appreciate your body. You know, you do have two hands. Your body is not just centered in your genitalia, right?

(Laughter)

[Evy:] Of course..

[Sass:] You have two hands, you have two eyes, you have a nose, you have, like, lips… you have all these amazing things that, you know, that are part of you. Right, your body is a product of billions of years of evolution, right? That you hate it just for one simple thing, it doesn’t make any sense. So, I think that’s my number one advice. Find a way to be grateful, right? To, what they say, like, count your blessings. Right? No matter how simple it is, because it will help you get through life.

[Webster:] So I hear you have a poem to read for us..

[Sass:] Oh yes, I do have one. So, I actually wrote this poem very recently. It’s based on the very overwhelming experience that I had earlier this year. The title of the piece is ‘May Your Heart Be Lighter Than A Feather”

---Transition---

He was a star whose beauty I only admired from a distance
But the fates pulled a thread,
Stitching closer the fabric of space time between us
And we found ourselves dancing together
In the great darkness of the school of life
It was the first time I heard him talk
Of the stuff that makes him smile
And I could feel the beats of his heart
As he sprinkled our conversation with what gave his life purpose
If before he was a star, that night he was a far place
In a cosy smoke-filled room, crackling with so much joy
As we spoke about the meaning etched on our bodies
As he spoke of our shared interests,
I observed as his skin glowed
With a pinkness of a sunset in The Hague
That once awed me
His eyes were a never-ending well of aliveness
I wish he would see what I saw,
Even when he was just talking about tequila, traffic and tea
He was dazzling
Because of all these wonder, I must be turning so moist
That I turn into an oasis, attracting lots of thirsty creatures
But wasn’t interested to be their watering hole
As I was fully absorbed by his state of intense aliveness
I was a sea of swelling waves reflecting his incandescence

A bonfire lit, as I felt the heat of his breath
Leaking my skin to life, when he started kissing me
Gravity went wild, then rain
His heart was light as starlight
But now it was heavy as a dead, cold fish
As he wrapped himself of guilt for being simply alive
What was once a star, collapsed into a black hole
Shredding everything in its path

My mind wanted me to be angry, but my heart resisted
To be someone’s object of desire
Is also to be someone’s space of freedom
When you awake someone to their flesh
You set them free, it’s said
(??) {24:58}
The mythology inscribed on his body told a story
Of what happens after we die
Our hearts will be weighted against a feather
When the heart is heavier, one cannot live in the afterlife
A heart frozen by regrets
Weighted down by denying what keeps life fresh, flowing, flourishing
Will always be heavier than a feather
For anything as dead as a feather
Will always be heavier than a heart that’s alive
Unbounded, undaunted
A heart that beats unapologetic yes to life
It’s flesh, it’s soul, it’s chaos, it’s dance

[Clapping]

[Webster:] Thank you for sharing

[Sass:] You’re welcome!

(Laughter)

[Webster:] That was wonderful!

[Sass:] Oh, thank you so much!

[Webster:] Can you tell us about the poem? How you came up with it? What’s the story behind it?

[Sass:] It was of course based upon a very romantic, supposed to be a romantic moment, right? So, it’s… I saw this guy I knew from my past, like a decade ago, and then it’s the first time that we went out. And, you know, we connected a lot, and more than we both expected to, and just… it just is the wrong time, right? He is in a relationship. So it was like “OMG, why am I in this situation?” So, that experience became… it was really an overwhelm... it’s still very fresh right now, so I’m kinda stuttering talking about it.
(Laughter)

[Evy:] Uhm uhm

[Sass:] But, I had to process what happened. Right? Because It felt like you are being put in a situation that you’re already exploding with so much passion, and suddenly you felt as if, you know, a bucket of ice got thrown into you. Right? So, just died suddenly, so I was like processing what happened, but he helped me process it, right? He was a real gentleman. Really really nice guy. But he’s just anyone, any human being. I think as you grow older, we become more understanding of human frailty, right? So I was like, you know, I was understanding, I was understanding what was going on and told him that ‘do not overthink it, you know, shit happens’. And, of course, I just told him that I hoped that I wasn’t put in the situation but it already happened so he helped me process it, and while I was processing it, I got inspired to write. A lot of things that’s there as I still did earlier, I was really interested in forming a narrative. So it’s really about what happened all throughout the night, right? And the symbol is in there, things that he talked about. And I was like connecting the dots of what happened, I’m just, like, it was actually a very poetic experience, so I might as well write something about it, so yeah…

(Laughter)


[Webster:] That’s the amazing thing about being an artist… is you can take experiences like those, whether it’s positive or negative, and turn it into something that we can also take part in.

[Sass:] Yeah, I think that’s part of the artist temperament. That you find the explicitness in everything, right? Pain, joy, what have you! Right? And you convert it into something beautiful. So, I think that’s something that I’ve developed all throughout the years. Like when I experience… That’s why I think I do… when I talk about something in the past, no matter how dark they are, I do not talk about it as if I were depressed, right? My psychologist, the psychologist who actually attended… who actually guided me all throughout the process of physical transition, while I was talking about a very traumatic incident in my life, she was just like, “you look so well adjusted that you just talk about it as if, like, you know, it was nothing, but it’s really really heavy.” I was just like, well, it’s just like something that I already processed”. Maybe wrote several poems about...

(Laughter)

[Sass:] Yeah…

[Webster:] Yeah, it’s an amazing ability to be able to go through an experience, step back from that experience, and then look at it with kind of fresh eyes. And I think that’s something that lots of people need to do, whether you went through a traumatic experience or not.

[Sass:] Uhm, because I’m a… I consider myself a Buddhist, especially Zen Buddhist. So I do a lot of reflective exercise, meditation, etc., so that kind of helped me, like, you know, observe myself from a distance. And then… and that kind of helped me go through a lot of things.

[Evy:] And that’s kind of also like you dissociate yourself without that person, you are someone new because you went through that and then you became better, stronger, more creative. I don’t know, like, it’s new things that you put on yourself, right?

[Sass:] Yeah, I think more... just more alive.

[Evy:] Yeah…

[Sass:] Just… because pain makes you feel that you are alive.

(Laughter)

[Sass:] Right?

[Evy:] It really does!

[Sass:] So I think it just, you know, just made me really more alive. That’s why when I’m experiencing pain, I do not try, I do not drown it. I do not drink to drown it; I do not, like, do drugs, or… I really experience it. Like, really experience it fully. Like what it is; how heavy it is. And then, so that I would have a more peaceful relationship, let’s say, with my own pain.

[Evy:] Yeah

[Sass:] Like, even when I had a surgery, I never really had pain killers

[Evy:] Wow..

[Sass:] My painkillers was just like ibuprofen. Imagine a..

(Laughter/inaudible)

[Sass:] And then I… because I really wanna experience, you know, the pain, right? And go through with it. Because I… it will pass right? Either I die with it, or, you know, I came out stronger out of it. So I really wanna experience the pain fully. So that’s why I always like… My friends noticed… like when I cry, I really cry, and then they’re “my God, you’re like falling!” Let me experience this, if I’m gonna be, like, distraught, I’m gonna be distraught [laughter]

[Evy:] It’s a very conscious way to let yourself go through that, because pain or any emotions is like waves, but it’s still the same water. Right? Like, it’s still part of the construct…

[Sass:] Exactly, because I think a lot of us have this very negative and antagonistic relationship with pain, and that makes it more painful.

(Laughter)

[Evy:] Yeah, but it’s also like society does not really celebrate pain in that way, because we’re really hedonistically minded, in a way, in many ways, right?

[Sass:] We always think about pleasure, right? Like, what attracted me to techno are those DJ’s who have a really good dance philosophy. That they are not there to make the dance floor as a space for escape, but for people to confront their reality. So, a lot of… those are the DJ’s that inspire me, and actually inspired me to construct myself according to that, that it’s not about making you escape reality, but you confront it and have a catharsis because you have fully engaged with your reality.

[Evy:] Alright.

[Webster:] Yeah, I was thinking about that earlier today. How I spend so much of my time tryna block out things, you know? If I’m alone and I’m cooking, I’ll put on a podcast so I don’t have to be alone with my thoughts, you know? Or, you know, if I’m in pain, I’ll take a painkiller. Do you think people today are too sensitive to pain, and that we do need to take a page from your book effectively, and feel more of what life throws us and be able to process it? Or is it just, you know, is it like a symptom of the modern age where you have all these tools around to quickly get rid of any discomfort?

[Sass:] Yeah, I think a lot of people are being desensitized to pain, right? They’re being pampered, and that actually weakens them more, right? I don’t know if you know Jordan Peterson…

[Webster:] Yes!

[Sass:] He’s really a controversial guy! And I just found out recently that he was actually suffering from clinical depression, and then he got addicted to antidepressant. So, I was like thinking, can you imagine this guy who exude himself as being strong etc., is actually going through a really really difficult phase in his life. That he has… he was struggling for a long time! And then I realized that, and you are telling us to be strong? And then you cannot show to us how we can be strong? Because you are drowning your own pain. So I was like thinking, you know, we need to be more authentic about what we are saying, right? What we are putting out into the world. We cannot just say that, ok, like is happy etc., and then at the same time, we do not believe the message, because we do not live the message. I think that’s a very important thing, so yeah, I think people will need to feel more, right? They say that, you know, if the heart [inaudible]... the heart and the mind must be in sync, and you are a sentient being, right? You must feel something, right? Otherwise, you already died at this age and just get buried when you’re already physically dead. So you need feel more and appreciate more life itself, and understand that life is really shit and...

(Laughter)

[Sass:] It’s really shit! Like, and I’m looking… I know a lot of people who are in a good situation, and then when I became intimate with them, and then see how they live, it’s like “you are as shitty as everyone else!”, so it’s just like, you know, it’s just… One of my favorite authors is Joseph Campbell, and one of the things that he said was, “participate joyfully in the sorrows of this world.” So, even when you are going through a rough patch, you know, participate joyfully with it! And realize that, I think sense of humor would really help us a lot in going through things, and that’s why I made this ritual that the first thing that I do upon waking up is watching a standup comedy. So that I begin my day laughing hysterically, that whatever shitty thing that goes through my day, I was like, I’m already happy from the start, right? So I’m just like, OK, I can handle this.

[Evy:] That’s a great idea!

[Webster:] Yeah, I like it. Beats going for a jog anyway

[Webster:] Speaking of your processes, can you tell us about some of the other things that you do in order to, i guess, prepare yourself for the difficulties of life as you mentioned? Like, what grounds you outside of your art and comedy?

(Laughter/inaudible)

[Sass:] I think it’s just like about… because I’m an introvert person. Really introvert, like…

(Laughter/inaudible)

[Webster:] Nooo way! I’m not getting that vibe from you right now. I’d say I am introverted but...

(Laughter)

[Sass:] No, I’m really an introvert person, and I love spending time alone. I can talk in front of a huge crowd, but after that, when people interact with me, especially not in an intimate setup, I really get tired. Really, really get tired. Like, OMG, I need…

[Evy:] You go back into your shell…

[Sass:] Yes, exactly! And a habit that I formed when I was a kid, because I live in a very dysfunctional family. Like, if there’s a more dysfunctional family than my family, I’m gonna give you an award.

(Laughter)

[Sass:] So, how I survive it is through what I call looking through different windows. I use my books, I watch films, and, you know, I experience life, and it made me imagine that another life is possible. So, that’s a big part of my process. Like, really opening and experiencing life in different perspectives and that, you know, that mix helps me as well to make life, my own life more bearable, because I know that things can be different, right? So, you just need to be a little patient.

(Laughter)

[Evy:] And, yeah, it’s what you’re saying, it’s just a shift of perspective sometimes, because maybe you’re looking at it in the wrong way or… there is no wrong way..

(Laughter)

[Sass:] Yeah, there are different ways of looking, you know, at something

[Evy:] No, I really liked that metaphor about the windows, and kind of creating a different perspective all the time.

[Sass:] Exactly. Just, you know, being more aware about possibility. And that’s what I’ve been… I think I’m kinda lucky as well because I grew up with the internet, like… the first time that there was an internet in the Philippines.

(Laughter)

[Sass:] So I… Because I consider myself as a really hungry person, I’m hungry for knowledge, etc. And then, I just kept on researching and then I was like, “Omg, another life is possible!”, right? So it kind of helped me… kind of helped me imagine, and kind of live it as well, right? Cause imagine it’s so wild that I think that I’m already living what I imagined in some way.

(Laughter)



[Evy:] Right. Yeah, because you have to embody your dreams before they happen, right? You have to…

[Sass:] Exactly! That’s the thing, that’s the thing! embody your dreams!

(Laughter)

[Evy:] Wow..

[Sass:] Yeah…

[Webster:] So what are you excited about in the future?

[Sass:] Ah! I’m excited to moving here in the Netherlands, in Amsterdam!

(Laughter)

[Webster:] Yeah!

[Sass:] Yeah, because I currently live in Maastricht, and Maastricht is so pretty, beautiful, but boring.

(Laughter)

Yeah, and because I consider Amsterdam as my home, right? I was born free in Amsterdam, and my contract ends in August, next year, so I’m actually preparing for that so… yeah, so that’s what I’m excited right now. That’s the most immediate future that I can…

(Laughter)

[Evy:] The world is your oyster..

[Sass:] Yes, and actually a lot of projects in my head right now that I would like to actualize. I like to write. I’m actually in the process of writing already a lot of stories that feature trans characters, because I’m like, I’m thinking, “Ok, if there are not enough good representation, why not do something?” Right? So, I’m… different story lines that I’m working on right now. So, that’s what I’m… I’m excited of how they would turn out.

[Evy:] Yeah, we’re on the edges of our seats

[Webster:] Yeah..

(Laughter)

[Webster:] Stay tuned!

[Sass:] Yes…

[Evy:] Thank you so much for being with us today. Where fans and people who are curious about you can find more information about you?

[Sass:] Uh, well, I do have my own Soundcloud. My Soundcloud is Sass, that’s S-a-s-s-0527, and of course my own, my Facebook is just Sass Rogando Sasot. So, that’s S-A-S-S-R-O-G-A-N-D-O-S-A-S-O-T. It’s in my Soundcloud! The link is in my Soundcloud anyway, that’s the easiest one!

(Laughter)

[Sass:] So, yeah, and… oh, another thing that I’m working on right now is like, I’m developing this like, series of DJ set inspired by different things that I encountered in my trans advocacy. So they’re like celebrating triumphs, struggles of trans people in different cultures. And, I’m so happy that it’s been reposed by Female:Pressure. I’m happy about what’s going on with my current DJ’ing project.

[Webster:] Nice.

[Evy:] Nice.

[Webster:] It’s popping.

(Laughter)

[Sass:] Yeah, we can say that…

(Laughter)


[Webster:] Well, thank you very much for speaking to us, it’s been really really wonderful.

[Sass:] You’re welcome. Thank you for inviting me!

[Evy:] Of course!

(Laughter)

[Webster:] And for our listeners listening at home, you know where to find us at www.worduppodcast.com, where you’ll find past episodes as well as information about our guests. Thank you! Bye!

[Evy:] Bye! Doei!

[Sass:] Bye!

(Laughter)


Transcript by Mia Randrianaivo